As a number of people have advised, a small number of people are obviously misusing the report function here as “quickest way to remove an abusive comment from view”. The problem is it can be used to remove any comment from view.
The other way you can signal you think a comment is unacceptable, is to click on the link which says “Report Abusive Comment”. If a certain threshold is reached of people reporting it, then the system will automatically hide the comment from view, and place it into moderation for a moderator to review. This can be the quickest way to remove an abusive comment from view. This should not be used for comments you merely disagree with, but only ones that are abusive.
I’ve had another two comments parked in m moderation from yesterday’s GD:
Your comment is awaiting moderation.
Tall Man – it’s not the hidden comments due to down ticks that are the problem.
There seems to be semi organised reporting (clicking REPORT) that, if several clicks are registered, puts a comment into moderation, so it isn’t visible until it is released from moderation by presumably DPF. This can take some time, like a day.
This doesn’t just hide the reported comment in the moderation queue, it also appears to hide all comments in the thread below the reported comment.
This system was put in place by DPF to make it easier to report abusive and defamatory comments that have long been a problem here. It is a good idea, but some have been abusing this by malicious reporting. It amounts to mob censorship.
And:
Your comment is awaiting moderation.
Linking to a source is normal practice, especially when there is more detail there.
In the site Comments Policy – https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/comments_policy – there is no indication that linking to a source is a problem. I have never seen DPF say not to do it. I have had a strike for doing it.
Accusations of ‘link whoring’ amounts to a form of trolling to try to disrupt or discredit or censor. Reporting ‘link whoring’ seems to me to be an abuse of site processes. It is used to try to suppress free speech, something that is against the pro-free speech principles of Kiwiblog.
Be aware that this deliberate suppression of comments – it can affect whole threads – is an attempt to manipulate what comments everyone can see.
While DPF is staunch in promoting and defending free speech you cannot rely on discussions here being freely displayed due to the abuse of moderation by some.
It’s impossible to know how many comments are being affected as you only know if your own comments are being parked in moderation.
User-initiated censorship is not just an abuse of reporting here, it is an attack on free speech.
As Kiwi Dave said yesterday “the result of reporting some comments into oblivion (as distinct from downticking, which still lets people see comments if they really want) is censorship of some contributors to a blog whose attraction includes its lack of censorship.”
Nostradamus
Pete George – did you receive a shiny blog sheriff badge in your Christmas stocking?
Nostradamus – do you approve of abuse of the report function and user initiated censorship? That’s how it appears when you choose to ignore that and attack the messenger instead.
There is a conflict here between the principles of free speech, and those who keep defending a free-for-all that includes deterrence of free speech and active suppression of free speech
Did you receive a shiny blog sheriff badge in your Christmas stocking?
Or are you just a self appointed defender of abuse and censorship here?
Nostradamus
Hold on! You said I’d answered your question already – even though, actually, you answered it for me. Now you’re avoiding my question. Would you like me to extend you the same (dis)courtesy of answering my own question to you?
waikatogirl
“Did you receive a shiny blog sheriff badge in your Christmas stocking?”
Did it come with a big hat?!
mikenmildagain
Peter George Nostradamus is just another lawyer practising his sophistry.
Nostradamus
Mikenmild:
Just another lawyer as opposed to… what useful productive work have you done again? Something about a clipboard, shuffling paper and counting paper clips?
When someone leaves a turd on the footpath you either remove it or cover it up.
You, on the other hand, seem to want to ensure that you and everyone else gets to smell it perpetually.
The “hidden” function still allows you to read the post that has annoyed others to a large extent so I do not see what your problem is or is nostra right, you just want to tell others what to do?
You’re wrong. I explained yesterday but you may have missed it. This has nothing to do with hidden comments due to downticks.
If enough people maliciously click REPORT a comment and it’s thread automatically gets removed from anyone’s view into a moderation queue, where it remains hidden from everyone but the commenter unless it is released from moderation (this can take up to a day from my experience).
Some people are doing this deliberately to suppress comments from general view.
holysheet
When someone leaves a turd on the footpath you either remove it or cover it up.
Except if you are a stinking leftie. THEN you pick it up and throw it at anyone whose views you dislike.
Ed Snack
Pete is right in this case. Down-ticking to hide a comment (so you can still view if you wish to amuse yourself) is distinct from reporting a comment so it is completely removed until moderated.
This can be misused. I report some comments that I believe are completely improper or reveal personal ID’s or something like that. Otherwise I go with the idea that downticks is the appropriate way for the community to show it’s disapproval.
And that applies even if you dislike PG on principle.
Tall Man
Pete, pop along to stuff and see how they deal with that issue.
This blog is as loose as a goose compared to them and yes, I have had posts “referred for moderation” and that’s fie by me.
I have reported posts that I think are possibly defamatory. Those that are abusive that are directed at others I ignore, anyone brave enough to abuse me will receive adequate response, unless it is from an absolute numbnuts which i take as an uptick and move on.
Use your time to work on the big stuff, ardern the liar, lees-galloway’s inept and corrupt practices, genter’s useless husband gaining hundreds and thousands of dollars from her department without review, a lying thieving deputy pm with a measly 7% approval rating now down to 3.something.
Don’t sweat the little stuff, life is too short and if the owner/facilitator of this blog wants to moderate, block, hide comments, that is his right.
Swifty
PG – you have inferred repeatedly that people here are using the report function to censor comments or views ‘they don’t like’ or otherwise disagree with.
I disagree.
I believe that for the great majority of the time people use both the ‘thumbs up/thumbs down’ and ‘report’ features appropriately.
What I do see though is people here getting heartily sick of a few anti-social individuals using this blog to promote their personal or business interests in often very lengthy and repetitive posts and/or clearly attempt to drive traffic to their own sites – despite, in some cases, years of requests to stop it or at least tone it down.
To lump these cases in to your argument of ‘free speech suppression’ is ludicrous – these people are free to speak all they want on any subject on their own blog. Of course, they choose to continue to dump their shite on KB because their own sites have no readership.
I totally welcome the report feature as it allows the KB readership to exercise some influence over the small number of largely single-issue nutters who choose to come here and spoil things for the great majority.
If people don’t like this development – then they are free to move elsewhere.
“To lump these cases in to your argument of ‘free speech suppression’ is ludicrous”
I didn’t lump valid cases of abuse in my criticism. There are two distinct things here, reporting valid abuse and maliciously misreporting abuse.
“I totally welcome the report feature as it allows the KB readership to exercise some influence over the small number of largely single-issue nutters who choose to come here and spoil things for the great majority.”
DPF makes it clear this is not what the feature is for – “This should not be used for comments you merely disagree with, but only ones that are abusive.”
“The great majority” shouldn’t be exposed to different views?
a) you don’t know what the great majority think of individual comments. The great majority of readers don’t comment or tick.
b) It’s important in a democracy that different opinions and views are tolerated – that’s a fundamental aspect of free speech that some (a small number) here are trying to shit on.
Swifty
I should have made my point more clear. I am referring to linkwhoring, alone.
I regard repeated, persistent and long-standing linkwhoring as trolling/an abuse of this blog and I lately have taken to ‘reporting’ it accordingly.
I know you regard linkwhoring as legitimate (or at least a grey area as DPF doesn’t specifically mention it in his explanations of the report feature) but I don’t.
My point has nothing to do with suppressing people with different views.
Swifty – so you report things that are clearly not abuse, so are clearly in contravention of the Kiwiblog Comments Policy.
It will add to DPFs workload having to deal with misreporting.
“My point has nothing to do with suppressing people with different views.”
You are trying to suppress people doing things here that they are allowed to do.
If more people took to choosing things they didn’t like and reported them to try to have them suppressed free speech here would be a joke.
As it is there can be no confidence that comments here aren’t being effectively censored by users. The only unknown is how many. It pretty much stuffs the concept of free speech and open and fair debate.
Swifty
Yeah nah.
I’ve just said I believe repeated, persistent, daily linkwhoring IS abuse. Do I need to state it again PG?
If DPF disagrees – then he’s free to discipline me.
This freedom is speech thing from you is misplaced, in my case.
And as as frequent and persistent linkwhorer yourself here some years back, which never used to go down well – I would have thought you might have got the difference.
The comment that kicked this off (with a link to source and detail) was actually quite popular going by the number of upticks, and the comments it generated. It was on decolonisation.
It’s you who doesn’t seem to ‘get the difference’.
In my view the report function is very seldom abused. We have a few who purposefully annoy and their rash irritations may be quickly erased. They are subject to users at the time too and reporting is not automatic by commentator, reader or date.
Another group who get reported are the Labour Interns/trolls/ mischief makers who turn up when the COL needs diversion. They may get their noses tweaked or their tails pulled in this political forum. They are seldom offensive but do provide sport.
Comments can go into moderation randomly, which is not a bad thing for gentle control, when the post button is clicked. Those seem to appear quite quickly. We all post here as guests and DPF provides as wider forum and as well managed as can be reasonably expected. Freedom carries the price of tolerance.
JibberJabber
Everyone knows you have to supply your own tissues when you`re having a sook on KB. There`s no conspiracy, fuckwittery gets removed, start your own blog if you don`t like it.
Muttonbird
Interesting that the comments policy left out some important additional information on the report process outlined by Mr Farrar when it was introduced in 2014.
Note that this feature should not be used on comments just because you disagree with them. If you continually report comments that are not abusive or trolling, then I’ll suspend your account. The up and down vote buttons are what you use for agreeing or disagreeing with a comment. This feature is for comments that are highly abusive.
Perhaps Mr Farrar needs to update his comments policy and clarify just what he wants this feature to do and the conditions under which it should be used. Because I don’t see a lot of suspensions happening right now for flagrant misuse.
Swifty
Please give some specific examples of flagrant misuse.
Muttonbird
Pete’s put up several examples of non-abusive comments being placed in moderation under the 5 report rule. That is misuse according to Mr Farrar in 2014. I dunno, perhaps being in opposition has changed things for him.
Tall Man
In other words you don’t know but are being irritating for your enjoyment.
What a truly sad individual you must be.
secondcumming
In Pete Georges own words…..
“I have been pushing for blogs to be more transparent but they just don’t want to know about it…..generally the blogosphere is a very dirty and antagonistic place”
Pot. Kettle….. much
Maggy Wassilieff
Dear Pete,
when I rang you in the weekend about the abusive post Griff had placed on your blog, it was the second time I had phoned you about Griff’s abuse.
If I recall correctly, you removed Griff’s first post – Thanks.
But in between the two I have complained of, there have been other comments from him about me. (I find your site difficult to search, so haven’t checked back for those comments).
Last weekend, he got another suckerpunch into me on your site.
I don’t consider your site to be a safe site (at present), so I’m not commenting there.
Now, I’m not blaming you as such… for as you rightly put it some days back Sadly shitting in other people’s online nests is very common – some people get way with as much nastiness as they can, and then push boundaries more. I guess some people just have nasty streaks. perhaps they get some sort of power thrill from attacking others.
I don’t shit in other people’s blogs… I have never had one of my comments removed (unless nested below a removed comment) I do not do personal abuse.
But I don’t know who anonymous abusers are; I don’t know the relationship between those who abuse me across different blogs. I suspect there is a connection.
I applaud your desire for free speech free from intimidation, but I didn’t get it on your blog. Currently, I figure it is safe for me to post on KB.
Biscuit
Agreed, Maggy.
I often look at some post or other KiwiBlog and see (say) 45 upticks and 1 downtick and strive valiantly to see just what it was that the solitary downticker had seen to make him/her/it so moved to vote.
I’ve never reported with a view to having a post removed just because I disagreed with it … and wonder if one way to see that sort of thing curtailed would be if the names of each ‘reporter’ were carried below the posts they did report.
Along with an automated ‘suggestion’ by DPF after every tenth (or so) ‘report’ that the reporter in question go outside and smell the daisies for a while rather than vent in here…
Maggy, as far as I’m aware i dealt with the issue raised by you in Your NZ straight away, and I’m not aware of anything since – you haven’t reported anything further.
Unless all comments are pre-moderated (that would cripple most blogs) there is no way of stopping all abuse from happening. It should be dealt with as soon as possible after it has been reported or noticed. That’s what i do, and in my experience that’s what DPF does – but with the much larger number of comments here it’s difficult to handle.
Maybe you are being mistreated here. I see 3 downticks and no reason. You do not come here as a political foe but as a respected blogger in your own right. There are a handful here to whom anybody not of their is ilk is a decided enemy. They are at war with most of the world and probably themselves too. Your blog is likely the cause of the personal attack. I doubt if DPF can do much more.
Tall Man
I down ticked him because he is like a dog with a bone and keeps posting the same argument. I also object to someone, anyone having the audacity to criticise the provider/operator of the blog for operating it as they see fit.
From the bulk of the comments that I see this gang of posters are probably the least likely to form an “anti free speech” cohort and get together to “report” anyone for no good reason.
Maggy Wassilieff
Dear Pete, According to my gmail files:
I notified you of abuse from Griff: on Mon 13 March 2017
From Griff & Robert Guyton: Sun Apr. 22, 2018
and From Griff: Sat Jan 5, 2019
Strike 3, and I’m out.
Longknives
I have been thinking about posting on another blog for a while now- But the Standard axed me after one post! So what does that leave? Sheriff Pete? Who despises me and went on a bizarre ‘Hate Speech’ rant after I admitted that I don’t have any time for Jacinda Ardern nor do I care about her family? (Shocking I know..) Or maybe I should look up my old mate Philu? Whoar could use the patronage- Just like Sheriff Pete’s blog that place is emptier than a Hermit’s address book….
Than
Pete George, exactly what moderation policies would you have DPF implement? He does have a responsibility to police genuinely abusive comments, and he doesn’t have unlimited time to devote to moderating. As far as I can see the current policy is a reasonable compromise between these requirements.
I don’t buy there is even semi-organised mob-censorship of comments using the report function, because plenty of comments from posters with unpopular views (Muttonbird, marquess, stephieboy, etc.) remain visible. Not saying there can’t be cases of comment that don’t deserve it being deliberately reported out, but claiming it is some organised censorship just doesn’t fit with the facts.
“claiming it is some organised censorship just doesn’t fit with the facts.”
I said semi-organised. A few days ago this comment was posted:
starboard PG reported for link whoring
My comment quickly disappeared into moderation – I think there is a high chance others took starboard’s comment as a signal to others to do likewise. That started the spate of report initiated disappearances.
DPF has since released all comments from moderation, so he presumably had no problem with the comments that had been reported.
Tall Man
They were released from moderation so the system works, just not fast enough for you.
Hi Pete, I think what happens is people try to reply not noticing the “reply” isn’t available and press “report” by mistake – I have done it myself.
Ed Snack
Certainly have done the same, but it takes at least 5 reports to send a comment into moderation, and I simply don’t buy that as an explanation for that reason. One or two, sure, but 5 ?
And note Muttonbird’s find from DBF’s rules, abusive use of the report function will lead to suspension. If David would do that a couple of times to those who do abuse the report function, I think it would improve matters.
But fair comment from Than, is there really enough of this going on ? Haven’t seen much, though NSF has been affected a bit lately.
Than
NSF is a perfect example of why hiding comments by downticks is a good system. Regardless of whether you agree or disagree with him (I honestly don’t know or care whether Lundy is guilty – just not an issue that interests me) his posts are just obnoxiously long*. Hiding them saves a lot of tedious scrolling. It’s not censorship because those who want to read them (or are just curious) can expand or collapse them as they wish.
* I say this with full awareness that many of my posts are on the long side, although I do at least try to post on more than a single topic.
Ed Snack
I think I’ve seen at least a couple of cases though where NSF’s posts have outright disappeared rather than just hidden (click to read more).
Of course if you don’t monitor the comments all the time one probably misses most outright removals unless another poster refers to that post in some way.
Tall Man
Some of NSF’s posts are bordering on libelous and those I have reported. The rest are usually just the ramblings of a sadly obsessed man so I downtick if I can be bothered.
Former Vice President Joseph R. Biden Jr. is in the final stages of deciding whether to run for president and has told allies he is skeptical the other Democrats eyeing the White House can defeat President Trump, an assessment that foreshadows a clash between the veteran Washington insider and the more liberal and fresh-faced contenders for the party’s 2020 nomination.
DigNap15
The democrats always seem to find it hard to get a few good middle aged candidates. Imho at 70+ you are too old to be a president or a deputy prime minister.
Tall Man
In my opinion, wynston is such a dedicated crook that he was unfit for the position at any age.
aredern the liar is supposedly popular because she is young and full of vitality but has been revealed as a rather incompetent vacuous and lazy little liar.
Therefore, age is not really a consideration but attitude and aptitude are more important.
fernglas
W
mikenmildagain
Agreed. Trump is way too old and although never demonstrating much intelligence, is clearly descending further into complete incoherence.
Ed Snack
You’re just the sort of person, mma, who would prefer the public groper “Creepy” Uncle Joe for POTUS, aren’t you. They’d have to make the White House a child-free zone if he was elected.
Funny how the allegedly stupidest presidential candidate in memory demonstrated a degree of political nous sufficient to overcome the almost universal agreement that HRC was destined to become POTUS. Though I’m sure you are happy to ascribe it to pure luck , and dumb luck at that.
mikenmildagain
I’d certainly hope the US voters aren’t presented with a choice between ‘Creepy’ Joe Biden and the incumbent Pussy Grabber-in-Chief.
Tall Man
Whereas your beloved, ardern the liar, has already reached a state of incoherence, not that she has ever had much to say worth listening too.
Pete George
Nostradamus
Pete George
Nostradamus
Pete George
Nostradamus
Pete George
Nostradamus
waikatogirl
mikenmildagain
Nostradamus is just another lawyer practising his sophistry.
Nostradamus
mikenmildagain
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qf7rntVimhw
Steve Todd
Tall Man
Pete George
holysheet
Ed Snack
Tall Man
Swifty
Pete George
Swifty
Pete George
Swifty
Pete George
Nermal
KevOB
JibberJabber
There`s no conspiracy, fuckwittery gets removed, start your own blog if you don`t like it.
Muttonbird
Swifty
Muttonbird
Tall Man
secondcumming
Maggy Wassilieff
(I find your site difficult to search, so haven’t checked back for those comments).
Sadly shitting in other people’s online nests is very common – some people get way with as much nastiness as they can, and then push boundaries more. I guess some people just have nasty streaks. perhaps they get some sort of power thrill from attacking others.
I do not do personal abuse.
I suspect there is a connection.
Currently, I figure it is safe for me to post on KB.
Biscuit
Pete George
KevOB
Tall Man
Maggy Wassilieff
According to my gmail files:
on Mon 13 March 2017
Sun Apr. 22, 2018
From Griff:
Sat Jan 5, 2019
Longknives
So what does that leave? Sheriff Pete? Who despises me and went on a bizarre ‘Hate Speech’ rant after I admitted that I don’t have any time for Jacinda Ardern nor do I care about her family?
(Shocking I know..)
Or maybe I should look up my old mate Philu? Whoar could use the patronage- Just like Sheriff Pete’s blog that place is emptier than a Hermit’s address book….
Than
Pete George
PG reported for link whoring
Tall Man
tf78
Ed Snack
Than
Ed Snack
Tall Man
MickMac
dime
Pete George
KevOB
Ignore the wannabe bullies. They suffer then.
Manolo
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/biden-sees-himself-as-democrats%E2%80%99-best-hope-in-2020-allies-say/ar-BBRTcPg
DigNap15
Imho at 70+ you are too old to be a president or a deputy prime minister.
Tall Man
fernglas
mikenmildagain
Ed Snack
mikenmildagain
Tall Man